Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Islamu

IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 24.06.03, 04:15
W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!

>> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:





Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
Crises, presents this brief biography:

Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
intelligence in Israel.

Akiva Orr has also published two other books:


Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.

The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the Jews to
Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:

The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.

A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.

This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 April
and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
not a liar. What would he say now?

There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)

    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 24.06.03, 17:30
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
      • Gość: sara Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.terra.net.lb 24.06.03, 20:26
        niegdzie zydzie nie zyli tak jak wsrod musolman,na wieki wiekow,naszem
        problemem z zydami zaczal od ich okupacji palestynskej ziemi
        • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 25.06.03, 09:46
          Gość portalu: sara napisał(a):

          > nigdzie zydzie nie zyli tak jak wsrod musolman,na wieki wiekow,naszem
          > problemem z zydami zaczal od ich okupacji palestynskej ziemi


          >> Oczywiscie! Ci, co chca wiedziec prawde, moga to znalesc w kazdej
          historii.Mam nadzieje ze bedziecie mogli niedlugo powrucic do swojej ziemi,
          domow i...odszkodowan za wygnanie i za wasz Holocaust.
    • Gość: jarek Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.fastres.net 25.06.03, 09:56
      Bylo tez czysta bajka zakaz jezdzenia konno Zydom, byl tez czysta bajka specjanny podatek nalozony na Zydow jezeli im tak bylo dobrze to czemu juz w VII wieku usilowali przeprowadzic sie do Morow w Hiszpani, choc oni tez byli musulmanami, ale nie byli Arabami. Jeszcze lepsza byla sytuacja pod Ottomanami, jezeli ich uzywal w Grecji przeciwko Grekom ( w jedna noc kazal przesiedlic Zydow z Thesaloniki na Rodos ) to tak ich nie traktowal w Damascu, Badgadzie tam im po prostu wszystkiego zabranial.( prawa do noszenia ubran kolorowych i posiadania drzewa ( nie mowiac o prawa do ziemi), moze cien byl tylko zarezerwowany musulmanom. Pozwolmy Israelowi traktowac w taki sam sposob swoich musulmanskich obywateli w Israelu to zobaczymy jak beda spiewac chwale Israelowi.
    • Gość: Oozie Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.sth.shb.se 25.06.03, 11:04
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      >Po tysiacach lat zycia posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych
      muzulmanow?!!!


      A ile to synagog ci "tolerancyjni" muzułmanie pozwolili zbudować w Mekce lub
      Medynie?
      • Gość: jarek Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.fastres.net 25.06.03, 11:12
        I nie tylko w Mecce i Medynie ale na calym terytorium Arabi Saudyjskiej.
        • Gość: zbalansowany Inne bajki IP: *.mel.dialup.connect.net.au 25.06.03, 11:38
          The Best Show in Town

          Uri Avnery - June 21, 2003

          The most talented director could not have done better. It was a perfect show.

          Television viewers all over the world saw heroic Israeli soldiers on their
          screens battling the fanatical settlers. Close-ups: faces twisted with passion,
          a soldier lying on a stretcher, a young woman crying in despair, children
          weeping, youngsters storming forward in fury, masses of people wrestling with
          each other. A battle of life and death. There is no room for doubt: Ariel
          Sharon is leading a heroic fight against the settlers in order to fulfil his
          promise to remove “unauthorized” outposts, even “inhabited” ones. The old
          warrior is again facing a determined enemy without flinching.

          The conclusion is self-evident, both in Israel and throughout the world: if
          such a tumultuous battle takes place for a tiny outpost inhabited by hardly a
          dozen people, how can one expect Sharon to remove 90 outposts, as promised in
          the Road Map? If things look like that when he has to remove a handful of tents
          and one small stone building – how can one even dream of evacuating real
          settlements, where dozens, hundreds or even thousands of families are living?

          This must have impressed George Bush and his people. Unfortunately, it has not
          impressed me.

          It makes me laugh.

          In the last few years I have witnessed dozens of confrontation with the army. I
          know what they really look like.

          The Israeli army has already demolished thousands of Palestinian homes in the
          occupied territories. This is how it goes: early in the morning, hundreds of
          soldiers surround the land. Behind them come the tanks and bulldozers, and the
          action starts. When despair drives the inhabitants to resist, the soldiers hit
          them with sticks, throw tear gas grenades, shoot rubber-coated metal bullets
          and, if the resistance is stronger, live ammunition, too. Old people are thrown
          on the ground, women dragged along, young people handcuffed and pushed against
          the wall. After a few minutes, it’s all over.

          Well, they’ll say, that’s done to Arabs. They don’t do this to Jews.

          Wrong. They certainly do this to Jews. Depends who the Jews are.

          I, for example, am a Jew. I have been attacked with tear gas five times so far.
          Once it was a special gas, and for a few moments I was afraid that I was going
          to choke to death.

          During one of the blockades on Ramallah we decided to bring food to the
          beleaguered town. We were some three thousand Israeli peace activists, both
          Jews and Arabs. At the A-Ram checkpoint, north of Jerusalem, a line of
          policemen and soldiers stopped us. There was an exchange of insults and a lot
          of shouting. Suddenly we were showered with tear gas canisters. The thousands
          dispersed in panic, coughing and choking, some were trampled; one of our group,
          an 82-year old Jew and kibbutznik, was injured.

          I have witnessed demonstrations in which rubber-coated bullets were shot at
          Israeli citizens (generally Arabs). Once I was in the gas-filled rooms of a
          school at Um-al-Fahem in Israel.

          If the army had really wanted to evacuate Mitpe-Yitzhar quickly and
          efficiently, it would have used tear gas. The whole business would have been
          over in a few minutes. But then there would not have been dramatic pictures on
          TV, and George W. would have asked his friend Arik: “Hey, why don’t you finish
          with all the outposts in a week?”

          In other words, this was a well-produced show for TV.

          A few days before, the leaders of the settlers met with Ariel Sharon. As they
          left and faced the cameras they uttered dark threats, but anyone who knows
          these people and looked at their faces on TV could see that there were no
          strong emotions at work. Of course, the “Yesha rabbis” (Yesha is settlerese for
          the West Bank), a group of bearded political functionaries, called on the
          soldiers to disobey orders and requested the LORD and the messiah to come to
          their help, but even they lacked real passion.

          Why? Because all of them knew that everything has been agreed in advance. The
          army chiefs and the leaders of the settlers, comrades and partners for a long
          time, sat together and decided what would happen, and, more importantly, what
          would not happen: no sudden attack, no efforts to prevent thousands of young
          people from reaching the place well in advance, no use of sticks, water cannon,
          tear gas, rubber-coated bullets or any other means beyond the use of bare
          hands. The soldiers would not wear helmets nor be equipped with shields. The
          settlers would shout and push, but would not hit the soldiers in earnest. The
          whole show would be less violent then a normal scuffle with British soccer
          hooligans, but would look on TV like a desperate battle between titanic forces.

          Ariel Sharon has some experience with this kind of thing. A dozen years ago he
          directed a similar show when, following the peace treaty with Egypt, he was
          ordered by Prime Minister Menahem Begin to evacuate the town of Yamit in the
          northern Sinai peninsula. At the time, Sharon was Minister if Defense. And who
          was one of the leaders of the dramatic resistance? Tsachi Hanegbi, now the
          minister in charge of the police.

          All the arms of the establishment cooperated this week in the big show. The
          media devoted many hours to the “battle”. Dozens of settlers were invited to
          the studios and talked endlessly – while, as far as I saw, not a single person
          belonging to the active peace camp was called to the microphone.

          The courts, too, did their duty: the handful of settlers that were arrested for
          resisting violently were sent home after spending a day or two in jail. The
          courts, who never show any mercy when Arabs appear before them, treated the
          fanatical settlers like erring sons.

          The whole comedy would have been funny, if it did not concern a very serious
          problem. Such an “outpost” looks like a harmless cluster of mobile homes on top
          of a god-forsaken hill, but it is far from being innocuous. It is a symptom of
          a cancerous growth. Not for nothing did Ariel Sharon – the very same Sharon –
          call upon the settlers a few years ago to take control of all the hills
          of “Judea and Samaria”.

          The disease develops like this: a group of rowdies occupies a hilltop, some
          miles from an established settlement, and puts a mobile home there. After some
          time, the “outpost” already consists of a number of mobile homes. A generator
          and a water-tower are brought in. Women with babies appear on the scene. A
          fence is set up. The army sends some units to defend them. They declare that
          for security reasons, Palestinians are not allowed to come near, in order to
          prevent them from spying and preparing an attack. The security zone becomes
          bigger and bigger. The inhabitants of the neighboring Palestinian villages
          cannot reach some of their orchards and fields any more. It someone tries, he
          is liable to be shot. Every settler has a weapon, and he has nothing to fear
          from the law if he uses it against a suspicious Arab. All Arabs are suspicious,
          of course.

          As it so happens, I have some experience with Mitzpe Yitzhak, the particular
          outpost that figured in this week’s show. Some months ago we were called by the
          inhabitants of the Palestinian village Habala to help them pick their olives in
          a grove near this “outpost”. When the pickers came near to the outpost, the
          settlers opened fire. An Israeli in our group was wounded when a bullet struck
          a rock at his feet.

          The “unauthorized” outposts were in fact established systematically, with the
          help of the army and according to its planning. When several outposts take root
          in a region, the Palestinian villages are choked between
          • Gość: jarek Re: Inne bajki IP: *.fastres.net 25.06.03, 11:44
            Jezeli cos takiego sie sprawi gdy role beda odwrotne ( w przeszlosci musulmanie wykazali sie rzucaniem cial umarlych na ospe do oblezonego miasta ) to bede mogl powiedziec ,ze to nie jest bajka, dziwne jest to , ze to Israelcztcy probowali doniesc zywnosc, nigdy nie slyszalem o takim czym, ze sie dostarcza zywnosc oblezonym, moze robil tak Saladim ?
          • Gość: jarek czy zbalansowany jest wybalansowany? IP: *.fastres.net 25.06.03, 11:47
            Mam do tego wielkie watpliwosci moze lepiej jak sie bedzie podpisywal sbalansowany albo sbilanciowany.
      • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 25.06.03, 15:58
        Gość portalu: Oozie napisał(a):

        > Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):
        >
        > >Po tysiacach lat zycia posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych
        > muzulmanow?!!!
        >
        >
        > A ile to synagog ci "tolerancyjni" muzułmanie pozwolili zbudować w Mekce lub
        > Medynie?

        >> A kto mialby w Arabii Saudyjskiej chodzic do synagog? Kozy?
        • Gość: jarek Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.fastres.net 25.06.03, 16:02
          Pewnie bo Zydow juz wymordowal Mahommed z swoja banda w roku 621.
    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 25.06.03, 22:26
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 27.06.03, 17:52
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 29.06.03, 04:25
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
    • Gość: marcus_crassus Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.tnt2.northbrook.il.da.uu.net 29.06.03, 05:49
      No to ladne kwiatki.A to znaczy ze nie tylko zydzi zydom ten los zgotowali
      tylko w Auschwitz.Ciekawe ilu zydom ten parszywy syjonizm poprzestawial klepki
      w ich koszernych mozdzkach ze wierzy ze to Hitler to sam zrobil.
    • Gość: jarek Jak mozna przesladowac martwego? IP: *.fastres.net 29.06.03, 09:02
      Spytajmy sie brofeta?
    • Gość: jarek Tysprowda- ponad 500 kosciolow spalonych IP: *.fastres.net 29.06.03, 14:57
      Wedlug raportu ONZ o nietolerancji religijnej tylko w Indonezji w ostatnim roku musulmani spalili wiecej niz 500 kosciolow, za niedlugo, jak nie bedzie tam wiecej chrzescijan, nie bedzie tez przesladowan.

      Komus ten artykul wydawal sie przesadzany, moze ONZ tez przesadza.


      Welcome!
      14-09-02

      We are an organization of people all over the world who co-operate against Muhammedan (Islamic) imperialism in all its forms:
      terror, propaganda, and so forth. Because we oppose the aggressive expansionism of Muhammedanism, we call ourselves Anti-Jihad
      (Jihad is the "holy" war for Muhammedanism).
      _____People from, virtually, all of mankind have joined this organization: People from every continent. Persons who have left
      Islam (apostates). Agnostics, Christians (Catholics, Protestants, Maronites, Orthodox, Copts), Hindus, Buddhists, Atheists, Jews,
      Sikhs. "Blacks", "whites", "reds" and "yellows". Men and women. Old and young. Company owners, students, journalists, Ph.D.s,
      people from the navy and army, musicians...
      _____Throughout history, there has been countless examples of the tragic consequences of Muhammedan imperialism: Millions of dead
      or forcibly converted when the Muhammedan armies from Arabia conquered. 14 million black Africans stolen and used as slaves in the
      Muhammedan world1. Dozens of eradicated "Kafir" (non-Muhammedan) cultures2. Millions of slaughtered Hindus, hundreds or thousands
      of destroyed Hindu temples3. An area that is called "Hindu Kush", which means "Hindu Slaughter". Millions of oppressed Christians
      and Jews, having to pay extremely high taxes for not being Muhammedans4. Tens of thousands of babies stolen from Christians
      (so-called "child tribute") by the Muhammedan Turks to be raised as fanatic Muhammedan elite soldiers. Countless "Jihads" to make
      even more lands Muhammedan. Thousands of secular Algerians brutally slaughtered with weapons such as bombs and chain-saws.
      Destroyed churches in the Balkans and Indonesia, among other places. Black Africans captured and sold as slaves in the 20th
      century. Devilish terror attacks against innocent civilians, mostly Hindus, Americans, Israelis and Russians...
      _____These examples clearly show why there is a need for us "Kafirs" (non-Muhammedans) to protect ourselves against radical
      Muhammedanism. At this site we show you how we counter that dangerous ideology, and invite you to join us.
    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 30.06.03, 16:41
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
    • Gość: |v|rowa Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: 134.174.196.* 30.06.03, 18:38
      forum.gazeta.pl/forum/72,2.html?f=50&w=6744350&a=6745558
    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 01.07.03, 22:43
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 03.07.03, 05:19
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
    • Gość: A.D. Re: Bajki o zydach przesladowanych w krajach Isla IP: *.mco.bellsouth.net 04.07.03, 05:37
      Gość portalu: A.D. napisał(a):

      > W dyskusji na temat slawetnego muru i oplotowania Palestynczykow w ich
      > rezerwacie przez Izrael, znana tu dana33 ze skierowywania kazdej dyskusji na
      > jalowe tory, uzyla w charakterze argumentu, jedno z wiekszych zydowskich
      > klamstw, sugerujacych ze zydzi musieli uciekac z krajow muzulmanskich 'jak
      > stali', bo ich zycie bylo tam raptem zagrozone. Po tysiacach lat zycia
      > posrod znanych z tolerancji Arabow i innych muzulmanow?!!!
      >
      > >> Prawda jest ze to zydowscy prowokatorzy syjonistyczni spowodowali
      > ucieczke zydow takim samym sposobem, jak to uczynili z Palestynczykami w ich
      > ziemi - w Palestynie. Aby zmusic zydow do ucieczki wrzucano materialy
      > wybuchowe do synagog i szantazowano zydow udajac ze sie to dzieje z
      > poduszczenia muzulmanow. Doszlo nawet do procesow przeciwko izraelskiemu
      > rzadowi, kiedy to okaleczeni zydzi z Iraku usilowali wywalczyc odszkodowanie
      > droga sadowa. Oczywiscie nie doszlo do takiego ...'skandalu' i droga ugody
      > rzad izraelski zatuszowl ta sprawe. Akiva Orr, zyd, opisuje te sprawy,
      > ktorego to opisu wyjatek przytaczam:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Akiva Orr: Stampede the Jews to Israel
      > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > ---
      > The back cover of Akiva Orr's book, Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity
      > Crises, presents this brief biography:
      >
      > Akiva Orr was born in Berlin in 1931, served in the Israeli army in 1948,
      > and after the war read mathematics and physics at the Hebrew University in
      > Jerusalem. He left the Israeli Communist Party in 1962 to start, with
      > others, the Matzpen Group. He conducts private research into artificial
      > intelligence in Israel.
      >
      > Akiva Orr has also published two other books:
      >
      >
      > Peace, Peace, and No Peace, with M. Machover, Hebrew, Israel, 1962.
      > The unJewish State, Ithaca Press, London, 1983.
      >
      > The following passage from Akiva Orr throws light on what is to most
      > Ukrainians a mysterious phenomenon — the virulent and gratuitous attacks
      > upon Ukrainians and Ukraine that can be seen to emanate in an incessant
      > stream from Jewish sources. The hypothesis which is strengthened by a
      > reading of the following passage is that these attacks are motivated, in
      > large part, by the desire to — in Akiva Orr's words — "stampede the
      > Jews to
      > Israel." This has been Israeli policy since the founding of the State, it
      > has been a successful policy, and it is the policy which is being adhered to
      > today. The favorite Jewish refrain of Ukrainian anti-Semitism is largely
      > imagined, and partly incited, as a tool of Israeli policy to steal Ukrainian
      > brains and talent for Israel. Thus, for example, Morley Safer's The Ugly
      > Face of Freedom of October 23, 1994, is a variant of the bomb which Israeli
      > agents threw into Baghdad's Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue several decades ago:
      >
      > The [following] incident occurred in 1970, when I was speaking in
      > Scarborough [England] at a fringe meeting of the Liberal Party annual
      > conference. I explained that the conflict between Israel and the Arab world
      > was essentially a conflict over lands and independence between Jewish
      > immigrants and the indigenous Palestinian population. Until 1948 Palestine
      > was populated by an Arab majority which was expropriated, exploited, and
      > partially expelled by the Zionist immigrants from Europe. The immigrant
      > settlers transformed the indigenous majority into a minority discriminated
      > against in its own country, and imposed upon it a discriminatory state
      > apparatus, namely a 'Jewish state'. No wonder the natives were restless.
      > This came as a total revelation to the audience of some 500, who were used
      > to apologetic versions of the Palestine conflict, in which Israel was
      > presented as a small, democratic state created by the Jews who escaped from
      > Auschwitz, a state that made 'the desert bloom', and that was beleaguered by
      > the surrounding Arab states for the sheer fact that it was Jewish.
      >
      > A lively session of questions from the audience followed. Suddenly someone
      > at the back of the hall stood up and shouted, emotionally: 'Israel expelled
      > the Palestinian Arabs in 1948 as a response to the Jews who were expelled
      > from the Arab states. This amounted to a "population transfer", which had
      > occurred more than once this century and was a legitimate, if cruel, way of
      > settling minority problems.' I replied that in 1948 Jews were not expelled
      > from countries like Iraq, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and Libya, but induced
      > to leave by Zionist emissaries from Israel who often used dirty tricks like
      > throwing bombs into synagogues to create the impression of anti-Jewish
      > persecution to stampede the Jews to Israel.
      >
      > This answer outraged my heckler even more, and he shouted in an agitated
      > voice: 'You are a liar, no Jew ever threw a bomb into a Jewish synagogue.'
      > The audience weren't used to seeing someone denounce a speaker as a 'liar'.
      > Being British, they assumed such an accusation was based on solid
      > information capable of withstanding a libel charge. The ball was now in my
      > court, but having encountered this charge many times before I was well
      > prepared. I had copies of the Israeli weekly Haolam — Ha-zeh (of 20 Apri
      > l
      > and 1 June 1966) with me, which published details, with photographs, of
      > these events. Some Iraqi Jews who had become disabled as a result of the
      > bombs thrown by Israeli agents into the Mas-uda Shemtov Synagogue in Baghdad
      > had sued the Israeli government for damages, in Israel. The government had
      > preferred to settle out of court and pay damages, but the legal exchanges
      > had reached the Israeli press and had been published by some magazines.
      > When I read out the details of the case from the Israeli magazine all eyes
      > turned back towards my adversary. I demonstrated convincingly that I was
      > not a liar. What would he say now?
      >
      > There was a moment of silence and then he blurted out: 'You see, unlike the
      > Arab countries Israel is a democratic state. You can publish everything in
      > the press there.' The audience burst into laughter; I didn't. (Akiva Orr,
      > Israel: Politics, Myths and Identity Crises, Pluto Press, London and Boulder
      > Colorado, 1994, pp. 5-6.)
      >
    • Gość: jarek Hi,Hi,Hi,Hi,Hi,- AD islamski bajkopisarz. IP: *.fastres.net 04.07.03, 05:59
      Moze zaczniesz przepiwasac Koran w ten sposob ,ze bedzie go mozna czytac jako Bajke dla dzieci , a nie jako podrecznik zgrozy i zacheci do przestepstw.
Pełna wersja