polish for foreigners

[polishforforeigners]

I'm a teacher of polish language. If you have problems with polish, don't
hesistate to contact with me.


POLISH FOR FOREIGNERS

If you are interested in learning Polish, your search is over!
Try simply communicative method!
Try lesson with very professional, enthusiastic and patient lecteur!

You see that the learning Polish would be not only effective, but also pleasant!


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my site
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interests or your actual needs


About me
- I have degrees in Polish philology at Warsaw University and speak English
- I have experience in teaching Polish to foreigners
- My present clients: businessmen, managers, ambassadors and students.

Contact
phone [phone]

[usenetposts]

polishforforeigners napisała:

> I'm a teacher of polish language. If you have problems with polish, don't
> hesistate to contact with me.

OK. Here's my query.

What would you say were the most important 20 plays written originally in
Polish that ought to be on the reading list of any foreigner wishing to become
acquainted with that part of Polish literature?

I'm looking forward to your response.

[polishforforeigners]

It depends on your proficiency level. I don't think that reading of literature
on the lessons is the best way of learning polish. I know more interesting ways
of learning and without your (English?) language.

[usenetposts]

Don't you think that Polish literature is worth reading for foreigners?

[polishforforeigners]

Polish literature is beatiful, but is too hard to know her without long
studies... Are you interested in learning Polish?

[usenetposts]

polishforforeigners napisała:

> Polish literature is beatiful, but is too hard to know her without long
> studies... Are you interested in learning Polish?
>

I'm interested in Polish at the literary level. I am not interested in learning
Polish other than Polish literature with a teacher. I only need a teacher who
can talk knowledgeably about the literature.

Which brings me back to my question.

What 20 plays from Polish literature are the most worth reading in the original?


Here is a list of 20 plays from the body of English literature which are the
most worthwhile reading for foreigners, in my opinion:

1. Christopher Marlowe „Faustus”
2. William Shakespeare „Hamlet”
3. William Shakespeare “Romeo and Juliet”
4. William Shakespeare “Othello”
5. William Shakespeare “Macbeth”
6. William Shakespeare “Twelfth Night”
7. William Congreve “The Way of the World”
8. Oliver Goldsmith “She stoops to conquer”
9. Richard Brinsley Sheridan “School for Scandal”
10. Richard Brinsley Sheridan “The Rivals”
11. Oscar Wilde “The Importance of being Earnest”
12. George Bernard Shaw “Pygmalion”
13. George Bernard Shaw “Arms and the Man”
14. John Millington Synge “The Playboy of the Western World”
15. Tennessee Williams “A Street-car named Desire”
16. Tennessee Williams “The Glass Menagerie”
17. Eugene O Neill “Long Day’s Journey into Night”
18. John Osbourne “Look Back in Anger”
19. Tom Stoppard “Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are dead”
20. Harold Pinter “The Birthday Party”

Here is a similar list for the German language and its top 20 plays:

1. Gotthold Ephraim Lessing “Nathan der Weise”
2. Johann Wolfgang Goethe “Faust” (part 1 and/or 2)
3. Friedrich Schiller “Die Räuber”
4. Friedrich Schiller “Don Carlos”
5. Friedrich Schiller “Wilhelm Tell”
6. Heinrich von Kleist “Der zerbrochne Krug”
7. Heinrich von Kleist „Das Käthchen von Heilbronn“
8. Christian Dietrich Grabbe „Scherz, Satire, Ironie und tiefere Bedeutung“
9. Johann Nestroy „Der Zerrissene“
10. Georg Büchner „Dantons Tod“
11. Friedrich Hebbel „Maria Magdalene“
12. Franz Grillparzer „Wehe dem, der lügt“
13. Gerhart Hauptmann „Die Weber“
14. Gerhart Hauptmann „Der Biberpelz“
15. Bertholt Brecht „Die Dreigroschenoper“
16. Bertholt Brecht „Leben des Galilei“
17. Max Frisch „Biedermann und die Brandstifter“
18. Max Frisch „Andorra“
19. Friedrich Dürrenmatt „Der Besuch der alten Dame“
20. Friedrich Dürrenmatt „Die Physiker“

Now please, as a teacher of the Polish language, provide the same list for
Polish. That is what I am asking for from you.

[minimus]

So, if you don't mind, I'll start:
1. Adam Mickiewicz: Pan Tadeusz

[usenetposts]

minimus napisał:

> So, if you don't mind, I'll start:

Sure, I'm happy to throw it open to the floor. It looks like our Polish teacher
could do with a bit of help with it, frankly speaking.

> 1. Adam Mickiewicz: Pan Tadeusz

Good choice.

[nasza_maggie]

Can I add Tango by Mrożek???

[nasza_maggie]

And Sienkiewiczs Trilogy?

[nasza_maggie]

Also I love Miłosz and most of his work is translated already.

[minimus]

Sienkiewicz would probably not be that good for brushing up the lingo skills.
More to understand why PIS is so popular.

[nasza_maggie]

Maybe not lingo skills but if you were to read it in English it would be fun.
Although I'm not sure if as much fun as in the original.
However I've not come across any translations of late.

I had 'Pan Tadeusz' in English but I had to return it. It was very good and
gave the feeling of the original, which was a surprise to me.


Lets not mix politics with nice stuff

[usenetposts]

The thing about Sienkiewicz is - I'm not sure he wrote any plays. This time we
are on about plays as a literary form.

Did Sienkiewicz and Milosz write plays?

[nasza_maggie]

usenetposts napisał:

> The thing about Sienkiewicz is - I'm not sure he wrote any plays. This time
we
> are on about plays as a literary form.
>
> Did Sienkiewicz and Milosz write plays?
>
>

Well im sure theyre much easier for foreigners than Witkacy and Gombrowicz

[nasza_maggie]

And Pan Tadeusz is considered to be easier to perform, as there aren't so many
battle scenes in it)))))))))
Otherwise I'm sure the trilogy would be equally as frequently staged )))))))))

Add ZEmsta by Fredro

[usenetposts]

nasza_maggie napisała:

> Can I add Tango by Mrożek???

Sure.

1. Adam Mickiewicz "Pan Tadeusz"
2. Slawomir Mrożek "Tango"

I might move that down the list later as in the English and German lists the
living authors are in the second half.

The lists do have more than one play per good playwright, so you could
have "Policja" as well, if you rate it as one of the top twenty Polish plays...

[usenetposts]

usenetposts napisał:

> polishforforeigners napisała:
>
> > Polish literature is beatiful, but is too hard to know her without long
> > studies... Are you interested in learning Polish?
> >
>
> I'm interested in Polish at the literary level. I am not interested in
learning
>
> Polish other than Polish literature with a teacher. I only need a teacher who
> can talk knowledgeably about the literature.
>
> Which brings me back to my question.
>
> What 20 plays from Polish literature are the most worth reading in the
original
> ?
>
>
> Here is a list of 20 plays from the body of English literature which are the
> most worthwhile reading for foreigners, in my opinion:

<snip English and German lists, as you can see them below>

> Now please, as a teacher of the Polish language, provide the same list for
> Polish. That is what I am asking for from you.
>

Well, polishforforeigners?

We've got, so far, "Pan Tadeusz" and "Tango", so there are only 18 to go.

Please outline the top Polish plays. It will be your free trial lesson.

[nasza_maggie]

>
> What would you say were the most important 20 plays written originally in
> Polish that ought to be on the reading list of any foreigner wishing to
become
> acquainted with that part of Polish literature?
>
> I'm looking forward to your response.




Hmmm do you mean in Polish or translated...??

[usenetposts]

nasza_maggie napisała:

>
> >
> > What would you say were the most important 20 plays written originally in
>
> > Polish that ought to be on the reading list of any foreigner wishing to
> become
> > acquainted with that part of Polish literature?
> >
> > I'm looking forward to your response.
>
>
>
>
> Hmmm do you mean in Polish or translated...??
>

Written in Polish originally. I left Beckett's "Waiting for Godot" out of the
English list as it was backtranslated from the French by the author.

That having been said, the theme does not need to be originally Polish. The
themes taken by Shakespeare are sometimes from Renaissance Italy or from
classical histories where English was not spoken, but his work became part of
English literature and is original in the English tongue. If we were looking at
novels, I would not discount from Polish literature "Faraon" or "Quo Vadis"
because Prus and Sienky were looking at ancient themes, but anything form
Conrad I would discount, as he used the English tongue and contributed to
English literature.

And just as my list for English contains several Americans and the German one
some swiss and Austrian, I use the term Polish to determine the language, so
Czeslaw Milosz is still writing Polish literature subsequent to his
naturalisation as a US citizen.

[nasza_maggie]

> And just as my list for English contains several Americans and the German one
> some swiss and Austrian, I use the term Polish to determine the language, so
> Czeslaw Milosz is still writing Polish literature subsequent to his
> naturalisation as a US citizen.
>
WAS, he passed away and is burried in Kraków with other honorary POles.

[usenetposts]

nasza_maggie napisała:

>
> > And just as my list for English contains several Americans and the German
> one
> > some swiss and Austrian, I use the term Polish to determine the language,
> so
> > Czeslaw Milosz is still writing Polish literature subsequent to his
> > naturalisation as a US citizen.
> >
> WAS, he passed away and is burried in Kraków with other honorary POles.
>

True, I didn't phrase that very well. I meant that his post-naturalisation work
is still Polish literature.

[kylie1]

Don't you find it odd that someone who claims to have studies Polish is
strangely stumped for words and unable to mention just a couple of names?

Adam Mickiewicz
Ignacy Krasicki
Juliusz Slowacki, etc


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_literature
strange.....

[usenetposts]

kylie1 napisała:

> Don't you find it odd that someone who claims to have studies Polish is
> strangely stumped for words and unable to mention just a couple of names?
>
> Adam Mickiewicz
> Ignacy Krasicki
> Juliusz Slowacki, etc
>
>
> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_literature
> strange.....

To be honest, Kylie, it OUGHT to be strange that someone setting themselves up
as a teacher of Polish to foreigners, and therefore making themselves out to be
an ambassador of Polish culture, is at a lost to mention these names, but in
fact it's par for the course.

Unfortunately, I'm not in the least surprised by it. In fact, I would have been
a lot more surprised if the person advertising their services had actually been
able to answer the question.

[sobieski010]

On the other hand I went to university in Antwerp and Leuven, and I could not
really name any famous play in Flemish / Dutch literature.
But I studied history and not literature, maybe that's why.

[usenetposts]

sobieski010 napisał:

> On the other hand I went to university in Antwerp and Leuven, and I could not
> really name any famous play in Flemish / Dutch literature.
> But I studied history and not literature, maybe that's why.

The Dutch language has little notable literature full stop. It's as if you guys
had to pay for those marvellous painters by not having something else. There
are a few half decent poets and novelists, but very little in the way of works
for the stage. For your information your greatest play is often reputed to
be "Palamedes" by Joost van den Vondel, but Shakespeare's ghost is not exactly
tearing his hair out with envy. A second Vondel play "Lucifer" is also said to
be of lasting value.

Don't feel bad. It's not a big country, so nobody expects the Spanish
Inquisition. In fact, it may well even be their fault that there isn't more in
the way of literature from the Low Countries, since they had their reign of
terror there for a good while.

[russh]

Hi Dave, I'm back after a little rest. Hope you guys are all well.

What does your query have to do with the learning of the language? Is it just a
wind-up (I think yes), or do you really think it is important to learn about the
literature of a language in order to be competent in that language.

[nasza_maggie]

Zemsta by Fredro

[usenetposts]

nasza_maggie napisała:

> Zemsta by Fredro

That's no. 3.

[usenetposts]

What about Lilla Weneda? Who wrote that? Doesn't anybody rate it? I thought it
had a restaurant named after it in the Marriott?

Are there any restaurants named after Shakespeare plays?

That could be quite a good idea for a chain of eateries.

[ianek70]

usenetposts napisał:

> Are there any restaurants named after Shakespeare plays?
>
> That could be quite a good idea for a chain of eateries.

"The Pizza Merchant of Venice"

[usenetposts]

ianek70 napisał:

> usenetposts napisał:
>
> > Are there any restaurants named after Shakespeare plays?
> >
> > That could be quite a good idea for a chain of eateries.
>
> "The Pizza Merchant of Venice"

That would be a good play to name a hamburger joint by.

It would give whole new overtones to the "quarter pounder"!

[ja_karola]

Juliusz Slowacki

[ja_karola]

Sorry. "Lilla Weneda" - Juliusz Slowacki.

[usenetposts]

ja_karola napisała:

> Sorry. "Lilla Weneda" - Juliusz Slowacki.

Thanks for that. I'll call that number 4. It would be good to have 6 more even
if we cannot find 16 more.

After all, this is a big and significant country, and was even more so
relatively to other parts of Europe in the past.

[usenetposts]

russh napisał:

> Hi Dave, I'm back after a little rest. Hope you guys are all well.
>
> What does your query have to do with the learning of the language? Is it just
a
> wind-up (I think yes), or do you really think it is important to learn about
th
> e
> literature of a language in order to be competent in that language.


I'm not saying that it is devoid of an element of wind-up. After all, you know
me. But in this case it's 10% wind-up, and 90% serious.

Think about it, in our UK system, at least traditionally, you wouldn't have
literature coming in at O level, but at A level you would, in our day and in
the better schools still today, have four short set texts from the literature
of the language. You also get topic-related projects, and these became more
fashionable and squeezed out the traditional literary approach to perfecting
the language in the GCSE highers and in the redbrick universities.

It still is the case that there is no better way than reading the literature to
get an advanced level knowledge of the language. The grammar book and
dictionary will only take you so far.

I once taught German to a retired lady, by the way. I started after I left
school in July and stopped when I left for Berlin on my year out in March. By
Christmas she had started literature and by March we were half way through
Heinrich Heine's Buch der Lieder.

And at the end of the day I don't need a teacher to explain to me the nuts and
bolts of the language - that's a memory game of patience that I need to play on
my own and a teacher only gets in the way. But someone to share and discuss the
literature with - someone who understands the culture and appreciates it and
can talk knowledgeably about the background: for me that's worth paying for.

[russh]

> Think about it, in our UK system, at least traditionally, you wouldn't have
> literature coming in at O level, but at A level you would, in our day and in
> the better schools still today, have four short set texts from the literature
> of the language. You also get topic-related projects, and these became more
> fashionable and squeezed out the traditional literary approach to perfecting
> the language in the GCSE highers and in the redbrick universities.

In my day O-Level English came in two forms - English, and English Literature.
For the Literature O-Level, we had 'A Midsummer Nights Dream' and 'To Kill A
Mockingbird', although for the two years we went through many of Shakespears
works, plus Orwell and Bernard Shaw. I never took English at 'A' level.


> It still is the case that there is no better way than reading the literature to
>
> get an advanced level knowledge of the language. The grammar book and
> dictionary will only take you so far.

Reading can also include newspapers etc. In my lessons I often take articles and
use them, especially if the article is of international interest. This can also
give you a more advanced knowledge of the language.

> But someone to share and discuss the
>
> literature with - someone who understands the culture and appreciates it and
> can talk knowledgeably about the background: for me that's worth paying for.

Language is only a part of the culture of a country, although important. It is
very useful when trying to understand a country's culture.

To me, what you are wanting of a teacher is not to teach you the language (you
are probably too competent or talented a linguist to need one, at least until an
advanced level), but to help you understand the people and their culture. This,
in my book, is something a little different, although related.

[usenetposts]

russh napisał:

> > Think about it, in our UK system, at least traditionally, you wouldn't ha
> ve
> > literature coming in at O level, but at A level you would, in our day and
> in
> > the better schools still today, have four short set texts from the litera
> ture
> > of the language. You also get topic-related projects, and these became mo
> re
> > fashionable and squeezed out the traditional literary approach to perfect
> ing
> > the language in the GCSE highers and in the redbrick universities.
>
> In my day O-Level English came in two forms - English, and English Literature.
> For the Literature O-Level, we had 'A Midsummer Nights Dream' and 'To Kill A
> Mockingbird', although for the two years we went through many of Shakespears
> works, plus Orwell and Bernard Shaw. I never took English at 'A' level.

I did. I have an English A level, and you cannot do it without literature.

These days most people only go into detail on Shakespeare at A level, not much
at O level. In my day I had the Pardoner's Tale by Chaucer in Middle English,
and that was probably the most challenging piece of literature. We did not have
anything earlier than Chaucer - I only went back to true Old English at degree
level, as one paper was in comparative Germanic Philology. The set texts were
the ones in the standard anthology by Sweet, published by the OUP. In the exam
you had to be able to translate any page out of that book into Modern English,
so you had better have studied the whole thing. If you did, they were the easy
marks on the day.

> > It still is the case that there is no better way than reading the literat
> ure to
> >
> > get an advanced level knowledge of the language. The grammar book and
> > dictionary will only take you so far.
>
> Reading can also include newspapers etc. In my lessons I often take articles
an
> d
> use them, especially if the article is of international interest. This can
also
> give you a more advanced knowledge of the language.
>

Agreed. But the one does not exclude the other, and whereas newspaper articles
are much of a muchness, the landmarks of a country's literature help to define
its national consciousness, and transnational consciousness. The fact that we
share Shakespeare with the entire English speaking world is worth more,in fact,
than any formalised "Commonwealth" or any "special relationship" based on
ancient politicians being able to "do business" with each other.

> > But someone to share and discuss the
> >
> > literature with - someone who understands the culture and appreciates it
> and
> > can talk knowledgeably about the background: for me that's worth paying f
> or.
>
> Language is only a part of the culture of a country, although important. It is
> very useful when trying to understand a country's culture.
>
> To me, what you are wanting of a teacher is not to teach you the language (you
> are probably too competent or talented a linguist to need one, at least until
a
> n
> advanced level), but to help you understand the people and their culture.
This,
> in my book, is something a little different, although related.
>

I think of it all time as O level, A level. Newspapers are of course good for
developing certain useful applications of the language, but they are ephemeral
in character, unchallenging as they use many international words, are often
badly written. No-one will remember these articles in twenty years time. I did
articles at O level, but do you think I remember a single one? Are there are
sentences in them worth memorising and laying to one's heart? Hardly!

Now a Polish teacher to Poles would not be given the job pf "Pan/i od
polskiego" if they did not know their literature, the way this person appears
not to have known. If this person is not deemed good enough by her own people
to teach Polish to them, then I don't think she's good enough to teach Polish
to me either.

I am now in the market for a mandarin native speaker, preferably form Beijing,
who can help me with my Mandarin. I would expact that person to know
Zhongguowei in both the simplified PRC and the Tainwanese full editions, as
well as Pinyin, and also to be able to assist me to the simpler end of Tang
Poetry and the Analects of Confucius in the original.

Polish plays 101

[ja_karola]

Let me come to the rescue usenetposts and provide you with an introductory
course on Polish theater. First off however, let me tell you that Polish
literature is one of the richest in the world although I’ll understand
accusations of bias given that I am Polish. You may wish to know that our
culture was for many centuries our only means of survival as a nation therefore
many classical works (e.g., the aforementioned Trilogy) were created while
Poland did not exist as a country. But let me stick to plays only, especially
since so many of you had wrongfully listed poems, novels, and historical epics
on the so called list.

Let’s start with the Great Polish Trio who are:

Adam Mickiewicz
Zygmunt Krasinski and
Juliusz Slowacki

Their works include:

Adam Mickiewicz:”Dziady” („Forefathers’ Eve”, „Ksiegi Narodu Polskiego”.
By the way, „Pan Tadeusz”, whose excerpts are required to be learned by heart
in our schools, is one hell of a long poem but NOT a play.

Juliusz Slowacki:”Lilla Weneda”,”Mazepa, „Fantazy”, ”Sen srebrny
Salomei”, ”Maria Stuart” (or the beloved Scottish Mary
Stuart), ”Kordian”, ”Horsztynski” and of course „Balladyna”. Slowacki wrote 14
plays in all. I’m simply listing the most popular productions.

Zygmunt Krasinski: „Nie-Boska Komedia” and „Irydion” – he wrote mostly poems as
well, but these two are his unforgettable plays.

Cyprian Kamil Norwid, as the ones above, is part of the period of Romanticism.
His works include „Pierscien wielkiej damy”, ”Noc tysieczna
druga”, ”Kleopatra i Cezar”, ”Krakus”, „Za kulisami”. Unfortunately his genius
was only recognized after his premature death.

Now let’s move on to the remaining great Polish authors.

Aleksander Fredro – the master of Polish comedy and also known as the Polish
Molière, wrote „Sluby panienskie”, „Pan Jowialski”, ”Damy i huzary”, „Maz i
zona”. ”Zemsta” (or “Vengeance) is already on your list and a great play (you
may want to rent Polanski’s recent version – great actors and English subtitles
available).

Stanislaw Wyspianski , Stanislaw Ignacy Witkiewicz (Witkacy), Witold
Gombrowicz – chief exponents of the Polish avant-garde (late 19th and early
20th century).

Wyspianski: his ideological trilogy: „Wesele” („The Wedding”, “Wyzwolenie” (
or Liberation) and „Akropolis”. He also wrote Hamlet (a paraphrase of the
Shakespearean drama). Also well known are his „Warszawianka” and „Noc
listopadowa” (November night).

Witkacy: „Matka” (Mother), „Szewcy”, „Wariat i zakonnica”, ”W malym
dworku”, ”Jan Karol Maciej Wscieklica”.

Witold Gombrowicz: „Slub”- play partly written in poem-form.
Gabriela Zapolska - the satirical comedies of manners „Moralnosc Pani
Dulskiej”the most famous),”Zabusia”,”Ich czworo”,”Panna Maliczewska”.

Modern play writers include:

Slawomir Mrozek whose plays are now considered as comedy classics. The
important plays he created are “The Police”, ”The Turkey”, ”Karol” and “The
Game”. His most famous is “Tango” (also already on your list) and “The
Emmigrants”, Mrozek’s second most often produced play after “Tango”.
Janusz Glowacki: “Kopciuch”, “Polowanie na karaluchy”,”Antygona w Nowym Jorku”.
The two former being produced on Broadway in New York.

Tadeusz Rozewicz; „Pulapka”, ”Kartoteka” - translated into 20 languages.

Edward Redlinski: ”Awans”

Jerzy Szaniawski: ”Dwa Teatry”.

Leon Kruczkowski: „Niemcy”

Tadeusz Kantor: of utmost importance to the Polish theatre. The creator of
the “theatre of death” movement or rather school. He’s considered to be one of
the most significant artists and thinkers of the second half of the 20th
century on the international scene.
He created ”Umarla klasa”, „Wielopole,Wielopole”, „Niech szczezna artysci”.

Adolf Nowaczynski: „Wielki Fryderyk”

Bruno Jasienski :”Bal manekinow”„The mannequins’ ball”

Karol Wojtyla ”Przed sklepem jubilera” – let’s not forget our Pope whose plays
are praised for their philosophical aspects and deep social commentaries.

Miron Bialoszewski: „Pani Koch”, „Szury”


I believe to have listed 21 writers and many of their works. If you are truly
interested in Polish literature, I don’t think you will find it difficult to
dive into reading. Should the language prove an obstacle, you’ll be happy to
know that most of the above-mentioned plays were translated into many
languages, and most certainly English.

If you’re a true aficionado, you may be interested to know that every Thursday
you can see a Polish play on the TV Polonia channel, a habit I’ve developed
over the years. I live in Montreal yet find it rather easy to stay in touch
with the rich Polish culture.

All the best learning Polish, which by the way, has been documented as one of
the richest albeit difficult languages in the world. Hope you find a good
teacher……


P.S. Jossif Brodsky, a poet and Nobel laureate, expressed his awe for Polish
poetry when he said that it is the richest, strongest and most beautiful he has
ever come across….. but I digress. Let’s leave poetry for another time.

[usenetposts]

Big UP to ja_karola for a great 101 on Polish drama. I call that Post of the
Month.

[babiana]

Thanks; I appreciate it! I made an effort...

[ja_karola]

Ooops! Sorry...the above message actually originated from me, but my computer
was logged in under another user when I sat down to respond.

Anyway...

[usenetposts]

Oh dear!

I have been known to do that, although not here, so I won't hold that against
you!