06.08.04, 21:24
W innym watku nastapila wymiana uwag nt Montrealu.
Ponizej cytuje post na temat tego miasta, jaki zamiescilem na innym forum.
Wybaczcie, ze po angielsku.
Chetnie porozmawiam.
Obserwuj wątek
    • chris-joe ooops... 06.08.04, 21:26
      In just over a month it will be 3 years since I moved to Montreal after 14
      years that I spent in Vancouver, British Columbia.
      I used to be, when I was growing up, decidedly a Francophile. From a
      distance of Poland I strongly sympathized with the notion and the nation of
      Quebec. In fact, when I was moving to Canada the original goal was
      Montreal. It was due to some personal and bureaucratic turbulences that I
      landed in BC. I grew to like it there, respect it, and -willy-nilly- have
      become an Anglo somewhat. With strong sympathy for the distant Belle
      Province always intact, even throughout the period of the separatist
      referendum. The referendum failed, Quebec stayed within the Federation, and
      so a few years later when I was moving here I didn’t need to cross any
      international frontiers- I took a domestic flight.

      Yes, at first I was smitten with the “European flavor” of Montreal, its
      nightlife, “the vibes”, the innumerable cafes and restaurants spread across
      the city’s sidewalks, vibrant, always teeming with people. You could smoke
      here (which after restrictive BC was a revelation), buy beer at a corner
      store, and the clubs were open (and full) till 3am!

      Initially, contrary to the ample warnings I had been given by my fellow
      British Columbians who claimed to know Quebecers, I found the local populace,
      if not overly welcoming, very tolerant towards me- a new Anglo arrival, and
      towards my pathetic attempts on broken French. I did try hard and after the
      first coy month or so I was insisting on speaking French rather than English
      with the locals, even if they found my French so… “French”, and I found
      theirs so… completely incomprehensible.
      After a short while though, many have grown tired and impatient with my poor
      French. There were insults and ostracism. Not that I don’t speak French -I
      do- but because I find it so difficult to understand. When I was learning
      English years ago in Vancouver, I found British Columbians wonderfully
      patient and understanding when it came to newcomers’ linguistic struggles,
      they were encouraging and tried hard to make themselves understandable.
      Unlike the French-Canadians. It is very rare, indeed, to meet someone here
      who would attempt to speak slowly and clearly for a learner’s benefit. It is
      sink or swim, and when you sink you’re on your own- you flanked, you don’t
      belong, adieu.


      So, when I first relocated here in a midst of a “no vacancy” crisis I rented
      a decent place for a decent price, I thought. That is until I was repeatedly
      told by the outraged Montrealers that I was paying way too much and that much
      better deals were to be had in the city. Soon I discovered those better
      deals. Yes, they were half the price of what you would pay in Vancouver, no
      doubt, but their standard too was half of what would be acceptable in BC. I
      may be wrong, but it seems to me that a better half of Montrealers live in
      places like those, and they are content. The “logements” buildings, as most
      of Montreal edifices indeed, are decrepit, little or no care is given to
      renovate them, to make them nice to the eye.
      Montreal does have a good number of spectacularly beautiful old-Quebec
      buildings dating back to the beginning of the 20th century, but they too are
      falling to pieces or collapse in utter neglect. Most are still inhabited and
      the rent is low (really “good deals”wink, it’s just that their standard would be
      close to that of Vancouver’s skid row. The famed and trendy and outrageously
      overpriced Plateau district is no exception.
      To add insult to this peculiarity- the city is filthy! The filthiest in
      Canada hands down. Yet, Montreal’s hygiene may stick out like a sore thumb
      next to that of nearby Toronto or the next-door Ottawa but Paris is the
      yardstick here. “Montreal dirty? You should see Paris!”; “The traffic of
      Montreal? Try Paris!”- they like to say.

      The traffic of Montreal… hmm, let it suffice to say that for a pedestrian
      crossing a street on the green lights is less safe than, say, playing
      Russian roulette, and when one manages to survive this feat physically
      unscathed they still have to bear the most obscene verbal abuses hurled at
      them for daring to be in the way of a “je me souviens” vehicle. There seems
      to be no single traffic rule heeded here, and the police… (But hey, try
      Paris!)

      When I speak with Montrealers of this “being laid back” when it comes to the
      traffic rules, they laugh (one called it “a ballet”, lovingly), they think it
      cute when I find it arrogant and outright dangerous.

      Vancouverites are the most avid critics of their city, bitching about
      Vancouver is widespread there and encouraged. In fact, you’re not a true
      Vancouverite until you are able to spend an entire afternoon over a cup of
      coffee verbally tearing Vancouver to smithereens.
      In Montreal, however, when you’re asked “Oh, so you’re from Vancouver, how do
      you like it here?” you have to bear in mind that what they’re really asking
      is “Isn’t Montreal the best?! You must be soooo happy to have moved here.
      On the scale from 1 to 10 how would you rate Montreal- 11 or 10.99?”
      I confess to have forgotten about it once in one of my careless moments. And
      so, when a cabby asked me THE question, after having listed all the pros (I
      was being so slyly diplomatic, I thought) I ventured into mentioning some of
      my favorite peeves about Montreal. The cheerful and friendly cabby stopped
      the car (no stopping allowed in that particular spot, but remember Paris…wink,
      turned to me over the back of his seat, his face seething with hatred, and
      yelled in staccato “I have traveled the world and Montreal is the most beau-
      ti-ful city of all!” I eagerly agreed.


      And then there is the omnipresent Toronto complex. You are allowed here to
      choose any world city and declare you took a fancy to it. All but Toronto.
      When you mention Toronto in Montreal it is like you press a play button and
      what you always hear is: business, finance, stiff, boring, stuck-up etc.
      Mind you, no one here seems to have ever actually visited Toronto. Why?
      Because it’s business, finance, stiff, boring, stuck-up. “Oh, and no one
      speaks French there! In fact they don’t like Quebecers in Toronto. -Well,
      but if you’ve never been to Toronto, how do you know? -A friend of mine’s
      been there.”
      It must be the same one friend everyone here has and I’m still to meet him.

      I am not giving up on Montreal. Not until, at least, I learn (proper) French
      and am capable to understand Quebecois. I may move to Toronto by then, but
      then again, I may stay and, who knows, grow to like this city.

      Here you have it. I have bitched.
      • ana1p Re: ooops... 06.08.04, 21:47
        chris-joe napisał:

        > In just over a month it will be 3 years since I moved to Montreal after 14
        > years that I spent in Vancouver, British Columbia.

        pojechales za praca?

        > British Columbians who claimed to know Quebecers, I found the local populace,
        > if not overly welcoming, very tolerant towards me- a new Anglo arrival, and
        > towards my pathetic attempts on broken French. I did try hard and after the
        > first coy month or so I was insisting on speaking French rather than English
        > with the locals, even if they found my French so… “French”, a

        napewno spotkales innych ludzi z angielskojezycznych terenow Kanady. Czy twoj
        przypadek jest typowym codziennym obrazkiem?

        Jaka jest twoja opinia. Gdzie lezy przyczyna takiego nastawienia? Czy tylko i
        wylocznie z poczucia odrebnosci? Czy moze cos wiecej lub glebiej ...?
        • chris-joe Re: ooops... 06.08.04, 22:27
          ana1p napisała:
          "pojechales za praca?"
          -nie, poprosilem w pracy o transfer do Mtl. Po 14 latach Vancouver mi sie
          znudzil. Szukalem zmiany.

          "napewno spotkales innych ludzi z angielskojezycznych terenow Kanady. Czy twoj
          przypadek jest typowym codziennym obrazkiem?"
          -nie, nie spotkalem wielu, a lokalni anglofoni albo swietnie znaja francuski,
          albo zyja w anglojezycznych gettach. Bowiem JEST mozliwe, by zyc tu i niezle
          funkcjonowac nie znajac biegle francuskiego.

          "Jaka jest twoja opinia. Gdzie lezy przyczyna takiego nastawienia? Czy tylko i
          wylocznie z poczucia odrebnosci? Czy moze cos wiecej lub glebiej ...?"
          -po 3 latach tutaj dochodze do niemilych konkluzji- Quebecois wydaja mi sie
          strasznie zakompleksieni i przy Anglos reaguja troche jak wiesniak przy
          "miastowym". Czuja sie niewygodnie i rekompensuja to pewnego rodzaju arogancja.
          Do tego krazy tu strasznie duzo falszywych i negatywnych mitow na temat Kanady
          anglojezycznej i jej nastawienia do Quebecois. Oni baaardzo rzadko jezdza na
          zachod, raczej na poludnie, na Floryde, czy Kube, gdzie powstaly prawdziwe getta
          wakacyjne dla franco-Kanadyjczykow.
          Przedwczoraj moj quebecki znajomy (swietnie zreszta mowiacy po angielsku, a
          ktory nigdy nie byl w Kanadzie na zachod od Quebecu) zapytal mnie, czy gdyby
          pojechal do BC, to czy bylby bezpieczny jako Quebecois...

          Wkrotce zamierzam zabrac jedna psiapsiole do Toronto. Opowiadala mi banialuki o
          tym miescie (nigdy tam nie bedac), az wreszcie zebrala sie w sobie i wyrazila
          gotowosc na to szalone ryzyko, by tam pojechacsmile

          Zauwazylem tez cos innego: im biedniejsza dzielnica, tym bardziej
          separatystyczna, tym wiecej tam quebeckich choragiewek. Ci z lepszym
          wyksztalceniem wiecej jezdza, mowia po angielsku, robia biznes w innych
          prowincjach i wiedza, ze nie taki diabel straszny, jak utrzymuja provincial legends.


          • momo16 Re: ooops... 07.08.04, 00:26
            Znow sprawdza sie powiedzenie ze wszystko wyglada ladnie tylko z wierzchu i
            wszedzie dobrze gdzie nas nie ma smile
            Chris ma troche racji, ale brzmi troche sfrustrowanie. Quebec to takie troche
            panstwo w panstwie. Ale da sie zyc, mowiac tylko po angielsku i nie trzeba
            mieszkac w "gettach" tylko w zachodniej czesci wyspy, gdzie domy sa drozsze niz
            we wschodniej. Ja mieszkam na wschodzie, francuskiego dopiero sie ucze,
            sasiedzi w wiekszosci nie mowia po angielsku, ale rozumieja angielski kiedy sie
            mowi powoli. Oni za to - powoli po francusku i sie dogadujemy wink
            Kazde, kazde miejsce ma swoje plusy i minusy, nie ma sie co oszukiwac. Czesto
            krytykuje sie cos, czego sie nie rozumie albo sie nie zna - nie mowie tu
            absolutnie o Chrisie. Znam wielu ludzi ktorzy przyjechali na weekend tutaj z
            Toronto i mowili ze glupie, ze zacofane itd. Z francuskim byloby im pewnie
            latwiej sie porozumiec, ale trzeba tez uszanowac cudza odrebnosc i nie panoszyc
            sie - uszanowac zwyczaje i kulture.
            Ja lubie Montreal, po dwoch latach czuje sie tu jak u siebie. Rodzina mojego
            meza - Quebecois - zaakceptowala mnie bez zastrzezen. Zreszta kto jest
            Quebecois? Moja tesciowa ma 1/4 krwi francuskiej, reszta to inne
            zachodnioeuropejskie nacje, tesc pochodzi z Palermo. Prwadziwymi tubylcami sa
            chyba Indiance, ale oni mowia raczej po angielsku.
            Ktos dawno wpadl na pomysl zeby polaczyc ziemie francuskie i angielskie w jedno
            panstwo i stad tyle klopotow teraz. Podobna sytuacja jest przeciez w Belgii.
            Jesli przestanie sie tu nam podobac to przeprowadzimy sie gdzies indziej, a nie
            bedziemy probowali zmieniac kultury. Zreszta dla mnie nie tak wazne jest gdzie
            zyje tylko z kim... wink
            Pozdrawiam wszystkich
            • ana1p Re: ooops... 07.08.04, 07:25
              momo16 napisała:

              > Kazde, kazde miejsce ma swoje plusy i minusy, nie ma sie co oszukiwac. Czesto
              > krytykuje sie cos, czego sie nie rozumie albo sie nie zna - nie mowie tu
              > absolutnie o Chrisie. Znam wielu ludzi ktorzy przyjechali na weekend tutaj z

              zgadzam sie i tak w istocie jest
              a przy tym kiedy dostrzegam zjawisko pragne zrozumiec motywy, przyczyny,
              dlaczego i tak dalej
              Wyjasnienia Chrisa wiele mi daje i twoje rowniez ... opinie wielu ludzi mozna
              porownac i na ich podstawie wyciagac wnioski, jeszcze do tego wlasne obserwacje
              i wiem na jakim swiecie zyje - chyba o to tutaj chodzi
              Jakos do tej pory nie mialam okazji tak glebiej przerobic tematu Quebec i
              ciesze sie bardzo, ze tak fajnie sobie wymieniamy zdania ... smile

              > bedziemy probowali zmieniac kultury. Zreszta dla mnie nie tak wazne jest
              gdzie
              > zyje tylko z kim... wink
              > Pozdrawiam wszystkich
          • ana1p Re: ooops... 07.08.04, 07:18
            chris-joe napisał:

            > albo zyja w anglojezycznych gettach. Bowiem JEST mozliwe, by zyc tu i niezle
            > funkcjonowac nie znajac biegle francuskiego.

            o to ciekawa informacja

            > Do tego krazy tu strasznie duzo falszywych i negatywnych mitow na temat
            Kanady

            bede wdzieczna jesli podasz kilka najbardziej w/g ciebie drastycznych i tez
            takie ktore maja bezposredni wplyw na ksztaltowaniesie separatyzmu wsrod nawet
            tych bardziej wyksztalconych


            > Przedwczoraj moj quebecki znajomy (swietnie zreszta mowiacy po angielsku, a
            > ktory nigdy nie byl w Kanadzie na zachod od Quebecu) zapytal mnie, czy gdyby
            > pojechal do BC, to czy bylby bezpieczny jako Quebecois...

            czy myslisz ze to wynik "cichej" polityki separatystow czy produkt uboczny typu
            pies straszny bo glosno szczeka

            > tym miescie (nigdy tam nie bedac), az wreszcie zebrala sie w sobie i wyrazila
            > gotowosc na to szalone ryzyko, by tam pojechacsmile

            ciekawa opowiesc moze z tego powstac ... wodcinkach
            myslisz, ze moglbys wiecej na ten temat napisac?

            > Zauwazylem tez cos innego: im biedniejsza dzielnica, tym bardziej
            > separatystyczna, tym wiecej tam quebeckich choragiewek. Ci z lepszym
            > wyksztalceniem wiecej jezdza, mowia po angielsku, robia biznes w innych
            > prowincjach i wiedza, ze nie taki diabel straszny, jak utrzymuja provincial
            leg
            > ends.

            Zawsze uwazalam, ze "fundament" narodowego patriotyzmu lezy w masie ludzkiej o
            przecietnych lub niskich horyzontach ( rowniez w pozytywnym tego slowa
            znaczeniu) popatrz nawet na nasza historie, te wszystkie zrywy
            niepodleglosciowe, pomysly do nich rodzily sie w umyslach inytelektualistow a
            wykonanie nastepowalo przez gre na uczuciach szarych obywateli
            Czy to wlasnie dostrzegasz?
      • parkieciarz_z_vancouver Re: ooops... 06.08.04, 23:06
        Chyba jednak powinienes pisac po polsku bo twoj poziom angielskiego jest
        zenujacy - 'mildly speaking'

        byk za bykiem - glownie gramatyczne.czlowieku nie kompromituj sie.
        Po jakiemu to jest : '...From a
        ) distance of Poland I strongly sympathized .....'





        chris-joe napisał:

        ) In just over a month it will be 3 years since I moved to Montreal after 14
        ) years that I spent in Vancouver, British Columbia.
        ) I used to be, when I was growing up, decidedly a Francophile. From a
        ) distance of Poland I strongly sympathized with the notion and the nation of
        ) Quebec. In fact, when I was moving to Canada the original goal was
        ) Montreal. It was due to some personal and bureaucratic turbulences that I
        ) landed in BC. I grew to like it there, respect it, and -willy-nilly- have
        ) become an Anglo somewhat. With strong sympathy for the distant Belle
        ) Province always intact, even throughout the period of the separatist
        ) referendum. The referendum failed, Quebec stayed within the Federation, and
        ) so a few years later when I was moving here I didn’t need to cross any
        ) international frontiers- I took a domestic flight.
        )
        ) Yes, at first I was smitten with the “European flavor” of Montreal,
        ) its
        ) nightlife, “the vibes”, the innumerable cafes and restaurants sprea
        ) d across
        ) the city’s sidewalks, vibrant, always teeming with people. You could smok
        ) e
        ) here (which after restrictive BC was a revelation), buy beer at a corner
        ) store, and the clubs were open (and full) till 3am!
        )
        ) Initially, contrary to the ample warnings I had been given by my fellow
        ) British Columbians who claimed to know Quebecers, I found the local populace,
        ) if not overly welcoming, very tolerant towards me- a new Anglo arrival, and
        ) towards my pathetic attempts on broken French. I did try hard and after the
        ) first coy month or so I was insisting on speaking French rather than English
        ) with the locals, even if they found my French so… “French”, a
        ) nd I found
        ) theirs so… completely incomprehensible.
        ) After a short while though, many have grown tired and impatient with my poor
        ) French. There were insults and ostracism. Not that I don’t speak French -
        ) I
        ) do- but because I find it so difficult to understand. When I was learning
        ) English years ago in Vancouver, I found British Columbians wonderfully
        ) patient and understanding when it came to newcomers’ linguistic struggles
        ) ,
        ) they were encouraging and tried hard to make themselves understandable.
        ) Unlike the French-Canadians. It is very rare, indeed, to meet someone here
        ) who would attempt to speak slowly and clearly for a learner’s benefit. It
        ) is
        ) sink or swim, and when you sink you’re on your own- you flanked, you don&
        ) #8217;t
        ) belong, adieu.
        )
        )
        ) So, when I first relocated here in a midst of a “no vacancy” crisis
        ) I rented
        ) a decent place for a decent price, I thought. That is until I was repeatedly
        ) told by the outraged Montrealers that I was paying way too much and that much
        ) better deals were to be had in the city. Soon I discovered those better
        ) deals. Yes, they were half the price of what you would pay in Vancouver, no
        ) doubt, but their standard too was half of what would be acceptable in BC. I
        ) may be wrong, but it seems to me that a better half of Montrealers live in
        ) places like those, and they are content. The “logements” buildings,
        ) as most
        ) of Montreal edifices indeed, are decrepit, little or no care is given to
        ) renovate them, to make them nice to the eye.
        ) Montreal does have a good number of spectacularly beautiful old-Quebec
        ) buildings dating back to the beginning of the 20th century, but they too are
        ) falling to pieces or collapse in utter neglect. Most are still inhabited and
        ) the rent is low (really “good deals”wink, it’s just that their s
        ) tandard would be
        ) close to that of Vancouver’s skid row. The famed and trendy and outrageou
        ) sly
        ) overpriced Plateau district is no exception.
        ) To add insult to this peculiarity- the city is filthy! The filthiest in
        ) Canada hands down. Yet, Montreal’s hygiene may stick out like a sore thum
        ) b
        ) next to that of nearby Toronto or the next-door Ottawa but Paris is the
        ) yardstick here. “Montreal dirty? You should see Paris!”; “The
        ) traffic of
        ) Montreal? Try Paris!”- they like to say.
        )
        ) The traffic of Montreal… hmm, let it suffice to say that for a pedestrian
        ) crossing a street on the green lights is less safe than, say, playing
        ) Russian roulette, and when one manages to survive this feat physically
        ) unscathed they still have to bear the most obscene verbal abuses hurled at
        ) them for daring to be in the way of a “je me souviens” vehicle. The
        ) re seems
        ) to be no single traffic rule heeded here, and the police… (But hey, try
        ) Paris!)
        )
        ) When I speak with Montrealers of this “being laid back” when it com
        ) es to the
        ) traffic rules, they laugh (one called it “a ballet”, lovingly), the
        ) y think it
        ) cute when I find it arrogant and outright dangerous.
        )
        ) Vancouverites are the most avid critics of their city, bitching about
        ) Vancouver is widespread there and encouraged. In fact, you’re not a true
        ) Vancouverite until you are able to spend an entire afternoon over a cup of
        ) coffee verbally tearing Vancouver to smithereens.
        ) In Montreal, however, when you’re asked “Oh, so you’re from V
        ) ancouver, how do
        ) you like it here?” you have to bear in mind that what they’re reall
        ) y asking
        ) is “Isn’t Montreal the best?! You must be soooo happy to have moved
        ) here.
        ) On the scale from 1 to 10 how would you rate Montreal- 11 or 10.99?”
        ) I confess to have forgotten about it once in one of my careless moments. And
        ) so, when a cabby asked me THE question, after having listed all the pros (I
        ) was being so slyly diplomatic, I thought) I ventured into mentioning some of
        ) my favorite peeves about Montreal. The cheerful and friendly cabby stopped
        ) the car (no stopping allowed in that particular spot, but remember Paris…
        ) ),
        ) turned to me over the back of his seat, his face seething with hatred, and
        ) yelled in staccato “I have traveled the world and Montreal is the most be
        ) au-
        ) ti-ful city of all!” I eagerly agreed.
        )
        )
        ) And then there is the omnipresent Toronto complex. You are allowed here to
        ) choose any world city and declare you took a fancy to it. All but Toronto.
        ) When you mention Toronto in Montreal it is like you press a play button and
        ) what you always hear is: business, finance, stiff, boring, stuck-up etc.
        ) Mind you, no one here seems to have ever actually visited Toronto. Why?
        ) Because it’s business, finance, stiff, boring, stuck-up. “Oh, and n
        ) o one
        ) speaks French there! In fact they don’t like Quebecers in Toronto. -Well,
        ) but if you’ve never been to Toronto, how do you know? -A friend of mine&#
        ) 8217;s
        ) been there.”
        ) It must be the same one friend everyone here has and I’m still to meet hi
        ) m.
        )
        ) I am not giving up on Montreal. Not until, at least, I learn (proper) French
        ) and am capable to understand Quebecois. I may move to Toronto by then, but
        ) then again, I may stay and, who knows, grow to like this city.
        )
        ) Here you have it. I have bitched.
        • frankie36 Re: ooops... 07.08.04, 04:15
          Kurde,ja prawie dalam sobie reke odciac,jak zobaczylam cos napisanego po
          angielsku,ze za chwile ktos sie znajdzie ,by bledy wytknac.O ty polska
          nacjo,tak szybko zauwazasz wady i bledy u innych....
          • ana1p Re: ooops... 24.08.04, 07:42
            frankie36 napisała:
            > Kurde,ja prawie dalam sobie reke odciac,jak zobaczylam cos napisanego po
            > angielsku,ze za chwile ktos sie znajdzie ,by bledy wytknac.O ty polska
            > nacjo,tak szybko zauwazasz wady i bledy u innych....

            ktos proponowal aby pisac po angielsku ... trudno sobie nie wyobrazic jakie
            polemiki ten "zwrot historyczny" by wywolal ... masz racje piszac "o ty polska
            nacjo..."
        • ana1p Chris nie przejmuj sie :-) 07.08.04, 07:37
          parkieciarz_z_vancouver napisał:

          > Chyba jednak powinienes pisac po polsku bo twoj poziom angielskiego jest
          > zenujacy - 'mildly speaking'
          > byk za bykiem - glownie gramatyczne.czlowieku nie kompromituj sie.

          I znowu sie zaczyna spiewka jak pisal jeden polski poeta
          "O wy chamy, (...), gbury
          nauczymy was kultury"

          Kompromitacja lezy w tym jak poprawiajac kogos sam robisz bledy jezykowe
          mistrzu parkieciarzu i wcale nie mam zamiaru ciebie poprawiac ani ci zwracac
          uwagi co niniejszym robie

          Chris - pisz wiecej i w jezyku jakim chcesz

          Tylko ten co nic nie robi nie robi bledow
          I tylko ten nie robi bledow kto sie boi je robic bojac sie osmieszenia
          Bledy sa nieodlaczna czescia rozwoju czlowieka

          te trzy zdania ... jesli parkieciarzu powiesz ze to bzdury (te ostatnie trzy
          zdania) to bedzie tylko swiadczyc o tym na jakim gruncie stoisz i w jakiej
          atmosferze zyjesz.

          Chris nie przejmuj sie i pisz dalej ... bardzo mi pomagasz
          dzieki
    • sylwek07 Re: Montreal 06.08.04, 22:07
      czesc,ja bylem w Montrealu przez 3 miesiace.i faktycznie jest czysto ale bywa z
      tym roznie smile),ale co do jezyka to lepiej znac francuski bo nie raz mialem
      przypadek ze chcialem zkims pogadac a ta osoba nie umiala angielskiego,lub tez
      sie patrzyla na mnie jak bym mowil po polsku (a mowilem po angielsku)..a i
      widac ta architekture europejskasmile).warto zobaczyc smile..pozdrawiam
    • sylwek07 Re: Montreal 07.08.04, 09:58
      czesc Ania.jak bedziesz w Montrealu to zobaczysz pewna dzielinice
      (Westmont).dzielnica ze znakami drogowymi anglojezycznymi itp.a po za ta
      dzielnica znaki po francusku smile).podbno ci co maja chorogiewki na domach lepiej
      do nich mowic po francuskusmile).pozdrawiam
      • momo16 Re: Montreal 07.08.04, 17:16
        Sylwek! Pare tygodni temu pisales juz o tych napisach po angielsku, ale
        wybacz... nie widzialam ich. Bylam w Westmont tydzien temu i pamietajac Twoje
        spostrzezenia rozgladalam sie za takowymi. Jesli napis ARRET jest po angielsku
        to jestes troche "confused". Dlaczego inne znaki drogowe maja obowiazywac w
        jednej dzielnicy? WYbacz...
      • chris-joe znaki 07.08.04, 18:46
        W CALYM QC obowiazuja takie same znaki drogowe. Wszystkie znaki z napisami maja
        te napisy po francusku, badz po francusku i angielsku. Zdarza sie wiec
        zobaczyc, oprocz najczestszego ARRET, znak ARRET/STOP, lecz nigdy sam STOP.
        • ana1p Re: znaki 08.08.04, 00:14
          chris-joe napisał:

          > zobaczyc, oprocz najczestszego ARRET, znak ARRET/STOP, lecz nigdy sam STOP.

          no widzisz, to w BC jest inaczej jak u ciebie
          • chris-joe Re: znaki 08.08.04, 00:27
            dowiaduje sie nagle, ze sylwek ma albo mial racje- do niedawna jeszcze
            municipalities Westmount i Ville Mont-Royal (czesci Greater Montreal)
            rzeczywiscie uzywaly znakow po angielsku STOP. Wywolalo to swego czasu lokalna
            wojne, ktorej rezultatu nie znam. Jak bede w rzeczonych miastach/dzielnicach to
            zwroce na to uwage.
    • sylwek07 Re: Montreal 09.08.04, 19:29
      czesc,a to nic sie nie stalo,mzoe bede w tym roku w montrealu.to moze sie
      spotkamy>?co ty na to?a oprucz tego klubu polskiego na frontenacu cos jest(club
      czy dyskoteka polska gdzie przychodza polskie dziewczyny?)..pozdrawiam

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