UK - worst place for children to live

[varsovian]

This is just the slap in the face that the whole of British society deserves.
It's time the Brits woke up to the fact that they are anti-social family and
child haters who simply like to knock and ridicule everything of value. And
this goes from the top to the bottom of society. There's a basic lack of
decency and an omnipresent sinking to the lowest common denominator.
(Worringly, you can also see this slide happening in Poland, too. So there's
no room for complacency, I'm afraid.)

"The UK is the worst place in the entire developed world for a child to grow
up. According to the UN, Britain has the unhappiest, poorest, unhealthiest
and most neglected children of the world's 21 richest nations.

A report shows the UK languishing at the bottom of 40 different indicators
for child welfare.

The news will come as a big blow to the Government, which has made halving
child poverty by 2010 one of its key goals.

The Unicef report, which the children's charity releases later today, says
the UK lags behind in terms of relative poverty and deprivation.

Britain also fares poorly when it comes to the quality of children's
relationships with their parents and peers, child health and safety,
behaviour and risk-taking and young people's own sense of wellbeing.

The country rated higher for educational wellbeing but languished in the
bottom third for each of the other measures, giving it an overall placing at
the bottom of all 21 countries, along with the US."

[usenetposts]

They will just laugh it off and then wonder why the kids they spent so much
money on turn out to be junkies.

Happy in Holland

[tjbazuka]

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6360517.stm

[varsovian]

Mind you, there are lies, damned lies and statistics.
I smelled a rat when it came to material well-being.
This was based on the following:
income distribution in the economy (not purchasing power)
unemployed households (UK has a high level of single parents ...)
child-reported deprivation (children complaining about low wealth, poor
schooling and reporting fewer than 10 books at home)

[marcus_anglikiem]

usenetposts napisał:
> They will just laugh it off and then wonder why the kids they spent so much
> money on turn out to be junkies.

very well said...
as for the report, hardly surprising is it?
& especially if this is anything to go by:
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/devon/6366255.stm

[kylie1]

> Britain also fares poorly when it comes to the quality of children's
> relationships with their parents and peers, child health and safety,
> behaviour and risk-taking and young people's own sense of wellbeing.

One of the problems here is the fact that kids know nothing can happen to them.
Take the school for example...in our day, the principal would’ve beaten the shit
out of us if he got some lip or found out that someone was doing pot in the
"smoking pit". Today, the principal will say: "Oh, that's OK, he is smoking in
the DESIGNATED area". You are off the hook. It's the classic "out of sight, out
of mind" approach. You see kids hanging around shopping malls because no one
gives a damn if they have dinner to come home to. Moma and boyfriend spent the
last nickel on dope and now they need some privacy. What? Can't you go collect
some bottles? There is your mac and cheese right there. Hmmm

And speaking of loser parents, my husband had this contractor guy and his two
young kids show up in his office Tuesday. Must have been 4-6 yrs old. They were
running around and taking stuff off the shelves while the Dad did nothing. Then
he hears this big crash. One of the peckers pushed over the used drafting table
in the showroom and busted part of the drafting arm. If either kid was under it,
they would have been seriously hurt. He was dumbfounded, but another customer
starts rolling his eyes and giving this Dad the gears. “Why do you let your kids
run around like that?!!” Then the dad says "they won’t listen".
What a dickhead.

There is a push here to create “programs” to keep these kids in the system. Call
it what you want, Alternate, Vocational, etc., but it’s still loserville. I
feel sorry for those kids – I would never blame the kids but I sure as hell
would like to take a closer look at the parents.

[russh]

Kylie, you are so right. We can't ever blame the kids - they're a product of the
society in which they grow up, not the other way round.

What I say next relates to the British, but I believe it's valid for many other
countries.

I've being saying for years now that we've been getting it wrong (the we being
my parental generation and those after i). There's a whole list of reasons,
including; women working full time almost immediately after giving birth;
selfishness (of the parents); incessant marketing; rampant consumerism etc.

We've given our kids everything, but not the thing that they really need - time.
Time to educate, time to talk, time to know, time to love, and not least, time
to discipline.

We've allowed the extremes of our society to model our lives. We've allowed
teachers to be bullied by children and not be able to react. We've allowed
political correctness to marginalise tradition, and the majority (of people).
We've allowed a decent education system to be replaced by a a system where
no-one can lose - everyone must have degrees, and if they are not intelligent
enough, or maybe just aren't inclined, then the answer is to lower the standards!

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is that we've been getting it wrong.
If we are to have a decent society, then we need to change, and go back, not
forward, with many of our base values.

[usenetposts]

russh napisał:

> Kylie, you are so right. We can't ever blame the kids - they're a product of
th
> e
> society in which they grow up, not the other way round.
>
> What I say next relates to the British, but I believe it's valid for many
other
> countries.
>
> I've being saying for years now that we've been getting it wrong (the we being
> my parental generation and those after i). There's a whole list of reasons,
> including; women working full time almost immediately after giving birth;
> selfishness (of the parents); incessant marketing; rampant consumerism etc.
>
> We've given our kids everything, but not the thing that they really need -
time
> .
> Time to educate, time to talk, time to know, time to love, and not least, time
> to discipline.
>
> We've allowed the extremes of our society to model our lives. We've allowed
> teachers to be bullied by children and not be able to react. We've allowed
> political correctness to marginalise tradition, and the majority (of people).
> We've allowed a decent education system to be replaced by a a system where
> no-one can lose - everyone must have degrees, and if they are not intelligent
> enough, or maybe just aren't inclined, then the answer is to lower the
standard
> s!
>
> I could go on and on, but the bottom line is that we've been getting it wrong.
> If we are to have a decent society, then we need to change, and go back, not
> forward, with many of our base values.


It's impossible to go back, because so many people have no model of what to go
back to. We just have to try and help Poland not to repeat our mistakes. I
cannot see how anything short of very dramatic upheavals in all area of life,
(politics, the legal system, the media, the church, even) will get the UK back
in shape again.

[russh]

Of course we can go back. Even if the role models may not be there, they can be
created.

The difficulty is trying to find the right mix between traditional and modern.
Not easy, especially when there are so many different cultures in the mix, all
with a different view and aim.

[kylie1]

Good point, russh. What's been happening in the last few decades is the
dissipation of human spirit in an overcrowded society eaten alive by
materialism. Huge urban sprawl and massive development of technology are a
perfect formula for loneliness. Drugs and alcohol aside, in high-tech societies
people have an emptiness of spirit because they let themselves to be ruled by
their body/ego senses. I know kids whose well off parents don't have a time of
day for them because mom and dad are on the computer 24/7, buying high tech
gadgets for themselves and spending time with their own crowd. The only time
they eat together at the table is at Christmas. Of course, there are millions of
computer obsessed kids that drive their parents bonkers, but so many times you
will see it go both ways.

Many people today believe in nothing but survival. They will do anything to try
to escape from reality because their own identity has lost its meaning or
purpose. They have little or no connection to their real Self.

So how DO you stop people from repeating the same mistakes? How do you produce
new role models? Not an easy task. Certainly one that gives ME a pretty grim
vision of the future.

[marcus_anglikiem]

russh, kylie... such wise words... if only people like you were politicians!
such intelligence as yours ought to be running the country, not suffering from
its ills. oh despair! respect to you both!

[varsovian]

Internet forum - the new taxi driver!

It's a struggle bringing up kids even in Poland (small place just outside of
Warsaw).
We tend to stick out, and not just because I'm English (I have a Polish wife,
and the kids are bilingual). There are simple things like we don't
automatically complain about the teachers and our kids are about the only ones
inthe whole school who don't have mobiles.

[usenetposts]

russh napisał:

> Of course we can go back. Even if the role models may not be there, they can
be
> created.
>
> The difficulty is trying to find the right mix between traditional and modern.
> Not easy, especially when there are so many different cultures in the mix, all
> with a different view and aim.

Well that's one of the reasons why it's hard to go back, and the other is that
the PC brigade controlling the media and universities got us into this shit and
until they are, to use a northern expression, hoyed oot, they will continue to
get in the way.

The biggest reason why we can't go back is that we have too many people
dragging us down.

And if there is a slippery slope, then it's easier to drag something down it
than haul something up it.

It would take a massive counter PC revolution to sort things out in the UK, but
no-one seems to have the will for it. We see talk thta skirts around the
issues, but no-one is actually willing to take action.

Even in the case of fathers rights, a shocking blight on British society, the
minute someone actually wanted to fight they way anything in this life is
fought over, the whole movement collapsed as all the fond fathers with no
rights started wetting their pants and disowning him.

[ianek70]

russh napisał:

> I've being saying for years now that we've been getting it wrong (the we being
> my parental generation and those after i). There's a whole list of reasons,
> including; women working full time almost immediately after giving birth;
> selfishness (of the parents); incessant marketing; rampant consumerism etc.

Quite right.
Economists are always going on about how great it is for the economy that house
prices are so high and keep going up, but it just means that both parents have
to work full time to keep a roof over their heads. One or both parents should
take maternity/paternity leave, and most sensible parents would want to, but
they can't afford to.
People should kick down their bosses' doors and say, 'If you want your
employees to breed, and their children to provide you with profits in the
future, then give us creches, unpaid leave and all the shit they've got in
Scandinavia.'
And instead of vague guidelines and voluntary codes of conduct among
advertisers, there should be either a total ban on adverts aimed at kids, or
mass direct action against companies that abuse children in this way.

> We've given our kids everything, but not the thing that they really need -
time
> .
> Time to educate, time to talk, time to know, time to love, and not least, time
> to discipline.

The thing kids hate most is boredom, and if they're bored because their lazy,
useless parents are watching the telly all the time then they're going to grow
up hating their parents. And it's hard to explain to children that Daddy's not
lazy, just exhausted, or that Mummy does love them, so much in fact that she's
f***ed up on anti-depressants to stop her worrying about them.

The answer?
Good question.
But it's encouraging that the almost universal response to this report
(although most folk have pointed out some inconsistencies in it) has been 'Good
point, what can we do about it?', rather than 'How dare they insult me by
telling the truth about my country?', which was the mentality of a lot of
people and most newspapers in Britain 20 years ago, and in Poland even now...

www.sundayherald.com/analysis/analysis/display.var.1201160.0.0.php